Subpar Mage DPS in MC?

Joonibal · Post by **Joonibal** » May 5th, 2005, 3:13 pm

Very interesting statistics from Ascent's damage meters in MC boss encounters:

http://www.ascentguild.com/phpnuke/

Numnaydar · Post by **Numnaydar** » May 5th, 2005, 3:30 pm

Not surprised, seeing as how melee classes only keep getting stronger and stronger weapons, while Mages don't get much help at all with their dps.

Sebboh · Post by **Sebboh** » May 5th, 2005, 3:36 pm

casters are getting more and more + damage items, but at the cost of stats, where as melee gets better and better weapons without having to sacrifice many stats.

Firby · Post by **Firby** » May 5th, 2005, 4:35 pm

Yea, for most "Uber Guilds", rogues are the top damage dealers with hunters right on them or mixed in within em, and mages falling behind by a good amount.

All melee classes continue to improve their gear and weapons pretty frequently after they hit 60, and their dps just continues to get higher and higher. There are very few crit items for casters really, and most of them have no +damage and very horrible stats (1% crit 6spi bracers? omgz, l33t). In order to increase our damage output, we have to sacrafice tons of hp/mp usually, which is a lil too risky. In my pure-dps setup, im down to 1780hp..gaining a total of 15sta from my gear (Ring of the Martyr, gotta replace). However, I'm also gaining +7% crit, and +235 damage to frost spells. Sadly, due to blizzard's incompetence, my main spell as a frostmage only gets partial bonus from the +damage, so its more like im only getting +150.

I'm not even touching the subject of the massive resists rates we tend to get, but that probably drops my damage done to a boss by 33%

Caster itemization has been a big issue since early closed beta..but blizzard just doesnt care it seems. Mages/locks will just continue to get left behind in overall damage until blizzard finally starts giving us some decent gear or some higher ranks to spells (quest, epic drop, anything, we will take it). In a MC clearing, as is, i wouldnt wear a single peice of the Arcanist set. None of it helps my dps really, blizzard feels mages should have 2500hp/9000mp and be happy with no dps or real use besides vending machines.

Oh well...even if I can't scratch ragnaros, I can summon food/water better than any of you bitches.

Sebboh · Post by **Sebboh** » May 5th, 2005, 7:55 pm

I <3 your water 8)

saemour · Post by **saemour** » May 5th, 2005, 9:10 pm

anyone who's played DotA already knew that casters suck in the endgame, it's up to quick damage dealers and high crits, especially those who can windwalk. clinkz ftw!

Tyraff · Post by **Tyraff** » May 8th, 2005, 12:44 pm

Sure, for a boss fight rogues and hunters might outdamage mages. But you're overlooking the fact that mages are useful for many other things other than dealing damage - polymorph, teleports, AEing, summoning things, etc...

Cry me a fucking river!

Nias · Post by **Nias** » May 10th, 2005, 7:20 am

Does anybody actually run there OWN damage meters? I mean common.. I do.. i know everything for the most part seems where it should be.. Mages dominate the list vs firelords.. and the core hounds.. were AOE comes into play. You cry about melee getting better and better DPS.. guess what.. i still have the same crappy main hand dagger i've had for 5 months now.. (off Voon) and i'm still the highest DPS rogue.. We're made to do direct damage.. so of course we're going to out DPS mages.. but the cost of doing so it having to feed us more heals.. we can't throw up a nice fire sheild.. or decurse anything. Blizzard isn't leaving you out to rot.. the only class that i've noticed get deadly with gear is warriors so far... Rogues gain the least bonus's from stats than most class's. I don't see why people are complaining.. to me.. things look like they should be when i evaulate the DPS meters that i get.. Next time your doing stage 2 of Onyxia.. watch that uber rogue DPS in action.

*edit* how come they don't list all the boss's in ascents boss list? mainly because the boss's they don't list rogues don't do so well..

Interesting to see how warrior weapons play in the longer Ragnaros fight.. Typhoon really did well there.

arkinia · Post by **arkinia** » May 10th, 2005, 11:18 am

Nias wrote:
*edit* how come they don't list all the boss's in ascents boss list? mainly because the boss's they don't list rogues don't do so well..

For us, Rogues will top the lists on Lucifron, Magmadar, Gehennas, Garr, Sulferon, Golemmag, Domo, and Rag. Shazrah we can't do anything, and Baron our DPS is hindering by runing in and out, while hunter's mages can just sit there. Mages spend time decursing during some of those fights wheras rogues have nothing else to do.

Nias · Post by **Nias** » May 10th, 2005, 12:41 pm

yeah my point was just that things to me seem fine how they are.. Mages play more of a roll in other area's as well.. and not having the highest DPS is understandable.. also the hunters top the list in our magmadar encounters.. due to having to run in and out. but to me.. rogues should have the highest DPS.. that's what we're made for. we're not really good at anything else.. Hunters also should have a good steady DPS over time... personaly nothing about those damage bars suprises me really.. Mages dominate in AOE.. rogues in direct damage..

arkinia · Post by **arkinia** » May 10th, 2005, 2:06 pm

Agreed. Not like stealth, lockpick, sap give rogues any utility in raid instances, versus tranq shot, summon water, Blizzard/Other AEs, poly, etc.

I don't think our hunters ever top magmadar.

People have been complaining about rogues in Molten Core for months -- I think its about time people recognize that perhaps there is a reason other classes damage may be "sub-par" in comparision.

Not to mention the obvious point that hunters/ mages take no melee range damage..

On an average 40 person raid, I tend to do ~8% of the damage, and use up 3.5% of the healing. A mage/Hunter's dmg/healing ratio is much higher. The "Avoidance" skill would be nice..

Talisen · Post by **Talisen** » May 11th, 2005, 6:45 am

I remember when those conquest videos came out. All I heard was how Rogues are not needed for anything.. ha! Why do you think I wanted to make a damage parser so bad? I knew what we were doing!

Vortmos · Post by **Vortmos** » May 24th, 2005, 5:36 pm

Hey Nias long time no see how are u jeff and tank.

Numnaydar · Post by **Numnaydar** » May 25th, 2005, 1:41 pm

Hmm, this post. Well, cloth casters might be getting a few buffs in the gear deparment in the future:

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/threa ... 1#blizzard

"Good post. The developers designing items have recognized that raid level cloth needs to improve, and many of the items added to the game in upcoming patches will have bonuses that make caster's equipment improve their spells and skills at the same rate as other classes.

As for Honor rewards - we will constantly be adding Battlegrounds and making improvements to everything involved in the system in future patches

- Ordinn"

Nias · Post by **Nias** » June 6th, 2005, 1:05 pm

Vortmos wrote:Hey Nias long time no see how are u jeff and tank.

Good.. sorry for late reply. been busy lately. Jeff quit WoW (Sad times) he still reads the forums.. and wants to play bad.. but it took over his life to much for him to controll.. i let him play Nias a bit last week.. he does miss it.. but it's been just over a month since he quit..